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The Edo had wiped out criminality thousands of years ago and it became virtually unknown to them. The Edo were a very peaceful and free-spirited society, being welcoming and friendly and offering themselves sexually to anyone who would accept. It was customary among them to run from place to place instead of walking.

However, due to their fear of their society returning to a state of chaos and anarchy, their system of justice only acknowledged execution as punishment for any crime.

The Edo were protected by a trans-dimensional super-entity which orbit around their planet, which they worshipped as a god .

In 2364 , the Edo made first contact with the crew of the USS Enterprise -D when they arrived at their planet for potential shore leave . When Wesley Crusher accidentally destroyed a greenhouse while playing ball with the Edo children, the Edo sentenced him to death. However, due to the intervention of Captain Picard , Wesley was saved. ( TNG episode : " Justice ")

The Edo were open to alliance and membership with powerful galactic empires, including the Federation . If they did accept membership of an empire, they would offer that empire the services of the Palace of the Edo, a structure that would raise the morale of every world in the empire. ( TNG video game : Birth of the Federation )

In one permutation of the mirror universe in which the Terran Empire survived into the 24th century , Captain Jean-Luc Picard of the ISS Enterprise -D subjugated the Edo after killing their god. ( TNG novel : Dark Mirror )

Known individuals [ ]

External link [ ].

• Edo article at Memory Alpha , the wiki for canon Star Trek .
• 1 Ferengi Rules of Acquisition
• 2 Odyssey class
• 3 Constitution class

The Edo God was a powerful lifeform or lifeforms that lived in orbit of Rubicun III , and was worshipped by the Edo . The lifeform considered the Edo its "children" and protected them from outside influence or threat.

The Edo God confronted the USS Enterprise-D in 2364 when that vessel was in orbit of the planet for possible shore leave. It had the ability to block communication with the Enterprise away team and prevent transport to or from the surface. When Captain Jean-Luc Picard brought Rivan aboard the Enterprise from the planet, the Edo God threatened the Enterprise with destruction until Rivan was returned. It also prevented Wesley Crusher from beaming out of protected custody until it was convinced by a passionate speech from Picard. (TNG: "Justice")

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The Edo are a humanoid species from the planet Rubicun III. They are very human-looking, the only notable difference in appearance being the lack of heterogeneity among them. After a chaotic past, they have turned their society to what is often described as “a paradise” characterized by concepts of peace and free love. However, they also uphold strict laws that required death penalty for all crimes. Their planet is protected by a transdimensional entity they worship as God.

• 1 Home System
• 2 Home World
• 4 Government
• 5 Description
• 6 Physiology
• 7 Psychology
• 9 Mythology
• 11.1 Clothing
• 11.3 Language
• 13 Technology
• 14 Military
• 15 Starfleet Intelligence Files
• 16 References

Home System

• Quadrant : Alpha [3]
• Location : A star cluster claimed by the Edo God. [4] The closest major travel hub is on Beta Renner . [3]
• Proper Name : Rubicun system
• Distance from Star :
• Companions : At least two other planets
• Proper Name : Rubicun III
• Axial Tilt :
• Orbital Period :
• Rotational Period :
• Classification : M
• Surface Water :
• Atmosphere :
• Population :

The origin of the Edo is unknown. Some speculation suggests that the Edo do not originate from their current homeworld of Rubicun III. Instead, they may have been planted there by a trans-dimensional entity the Edo worship as a God. [5] As with their origin, much of the Edo history is poorly known due to their lack of historical records. [6]

The Edo refer to their distant past as the “Chaotic times”. During this time period, the Edo would fight wars among themselves. At the end of the last war during the Chaotic times, portions of the planet were likely left barren wasteland. [7] The current Edo legal code was adopted at the end of the Chaotic times. [8] This legal system consists of randomly selected punishment zones, where laws are enforced by a group of “mediators”, who would issue immediate execution to the criminals they met. The adoption of the current law has seen criminality being eliminated practically completely among the Edo. [9] Other societal and cultural changes were also implemented at the end of the Chaotic times, including giving up eating meat. [10]

The Edo made first contact with Starfleet in 2364 , when the Edo welcomed a group of officers from USS Enterprise to the planet for shore leave. Despite the promising beginning, the first contact ended with an incident involving a violation of the Edo law and refusal of an execution. The Edo God met any attempts to take any Edo out of Rubicun III with force and asserted their control over the star cluster in which Rubicun III is located. [11]

After the first contact, the Edo and the Edo God began to be more directly involved with each other. [12] The immediate reaction to the first contact were restrictions on the Edo from leaving Rubicun III or the star cluster. [13] However, the first contact also led to fast societal changes and lessening of several restrictions and penalties. These changes were accompanied by social turmoil. [14] Eventually, the Edo started founding colonies on other planets in the star cluster claimed by the Edo God. At some point in or by the 2380s , the Edo wishing to leave for worlds out of their area could apply for a permit to do so. Some individuals joined Starfleet at that time [15] . The need for a permission was dropped somewhere in the 2390s . The number of Edo emigrants has remained low, as very few has chosen to leave. [13] By the early 2390s, the Edo had joined the United Federation of Planets . [12]

They abide by randomly mobile punishment zones to keep would-be offenders alert under penalty of a swift execution. Since the "punishment zones" are randomly chosen and rapidly changing, the system is a powerful incentive to obey all laws. The Edo welcome visitors openly as long as they conform to their system of justice. The Edo system of justice acknowledged only one punishment among them for any crime: execution with a poisoned syringe. Randomly mobile punishment zones kept would-be offenders alert, and the Mediators dispensed punishment for any violations in the punishment zones. [9]

Since an incident with a Starfleet crew, penalties for certain crimes has lessened somewhat - the Edo considered this to be a tumultuous period, but otherwise productive. [14]

The Edo society is marked by minimal hierarchies and a minor difference in political power between the leaders and the population. [16]

Description

All Edo look seemingly identical to Humans - however, the Edo seem to only have blonde hair [9] , and generally dress in less than Humans due to both their self-confidence and complete sexual freedom.

The Edo are very homogenous species, with little racial or ethnic diversity among them. Diseases are also rare among the Edo, which is why medical professionals are only in low demand on Rubicun III. [17]

The Edo have slightly higher preferred temperature compared to humans, for example. This might cause some Edo to feel slightly chilly in standard Starfleet room temperature, although the difference is not as prominent as it is to species like Vulcans or Cardassians . [18]

They can easily fulfil their nutritional requirements by eating plants, while eating meat can have negative health effects, especially if done regularly. [10]

The Edo practice a strange mixture of hedonistic sexuality and have a puritanical respect for a draconian legal code. Because of this, all Edo are incredibly law-abiding. Their entire society is peaceful, with what they consider to be criminal behaviour wiped out hundreds of years ago. [9]

Nevertheless, they are free-spirited and extremely welcoming to visitors. The Edo greet friends with a deep embrace and, often to the surprise of outsiders, offered themselves sexually to anyone who would accept. It was customary among the Edo to run from place to place instead of walking. [9] They are also immensely proud of their homeworld, some to the point of boasting about it.

The Edo are particularly easy to read by telepaths and empaths. It is not known if this is caused by biological or cultural factors. [19]

Though they are space-faring today, the Edo are protected by a trans-dimensional super-entity in orbit around their planet, which they worship as God. The Edo God has an appearance of a space station or similar structure and is normally invisible or transparent even to ship sensors. The Edo God considers the Edo to be their children and has been hostile to potential threats to the Edo. [20]

The exact nature of the Edo God is unknown. Closer contact has revealed there are multiple lifeforms aboard the station-like structure, indicating the Edo God is a group or a species instead of a single being. According to information revealed by the Edo God to Starfleet, they once belonged to the same dimension but have since evolved. They are known to occupy several dimensions and locations simultaneously. [20] An Edo from another universe once claimed the Edo God is the same in all universes, although this claim has not been yet verified. [21]

The Edo would occasionally pray to their God. They might continue to do so outside the vicinity of their homeworld, although they also believe the Edo God might not be able to hear them that far. [22]

Funerals typically take place in nature near the community home. The exact rite is not standardised, but each community may choose the course of the ritual. The focus is typically not in the burial or religious or spiritual aspects of the ritual, but rather the commemorating the dead individual and their role in the community. However, due to the beliefs held by some Edo concerning the spirits of the dead, some funerals, particularly those of criminals and victims of crimes, might involve addressing the supposed spirit of the deceased. The monuments are typically meant to be only temporary, lasting less than a decade. [23]

Some Edo believe in spirits, and the there are several myths concerning the spirits of the dead. [24] Due to the entity which they worship as God being a physical being while the spirits are not, the Edo separate “religion” and “spirituality”. Even though an Edo might be a follower of their God, they might not necessarily believe in spirits. [25]

It is generally believed that the spirit of a dead person will eventually fade into the nature and continue strengthening the community that way. Before fading in, the spirits are believed to inhabit and possibly interact with the material world. Some spirits, most notably those of criminals and the victims of crimes, might become confused or aggressive, possibly causing harm and being unable to continue to fade in. As such, funeral rites for these individuals might involve attempts to calm down the spirits and convince them to carry on. [23] [25]

They are at least aware of the concept of the living dead. [26]

The Edo have local communities with community leaders. Both the community leaders and the mediators wear a metallic necklace indicating their status. [2] [9] The necklace depicts two swirls, a symbol associated with the Edo as a population. [27]

At least in some regions, communal families are the norm. In this kind of familiar structure, those with whom an individual is close with are considered their family, regardless of their genealogical relations. As a result, an individual would consider everyone in their community their child, sibling, parent or grandparent. When changing communities, an Edo may start to consider the new community as their family as well, even when the new community is non-Edo. [28]

The Edo communities are generally small, and there are no large cities anymore. [29]

The Edo clothing tends to be minimal. Typical clothes worn by the Edo include rompers, and when wearing a Starfleet uniform or similar, they tend to prefer skant variants. [30]

The Edo do not tend to eat meat. Eating meat is not forbidden, but it is also not typical in their culture to do so. The Edo used to eat meat in their past, but it fell out of favour after eating meat regularly was shown to be unhealthy for them. Plant food is sufficient to sustain them. [10]

The Edo speak multiple languages or dialects, collectively referred to as the Rubicun Edo languages or simply Edo languages. These languages share a translingual writing system, which is based on a shared syllabary. Each glyph typically represents a consonant, a vowel, and a possible ending depending on its location in a word and other factors. The syllable glyphs have an order comparable to the alphabetic order in the Latin alphabets. For example, va is the fifth glyph in this syllabic order. [31]

Somian is one of the dialects or languages spoken by the Edo in an area on Rubicun III. It is written using the common Edo writing system. The word order in Somian is OVS, i.e. object-verb-subject, meaning that in a typical sentence, object precedes the verb, and the subject is in the last place. [31]

Hugs are often shared between family members and friends, as well as strangers. A hug is often used as a typical greeting, but hugs are also given for whatever reason. [32]

During typical handshakes, the contact would linger longer than most other cultures. This would often make people from other cultures uncomfortable due to the intimacy of the gesture. [33] An Edo-style handshake consisted of clasping forearms, rather than hands. [34]

Starfleet Intelligence Files

In 2392, Farquan was assigned to the USS Invicta as a diplomatic envoy, his people having been curious about the area the Invicta was operating within. [35]

• ↑ Just another geological curiosity? , Ens Jovenan, USS Artemis -A , 240003.07
• ↑ 2.0 2.1 P.S. I miss you (part 2) , Ens Jovenan, USS Artemis -A , 240005.15
• ↑ 3.0 3.1 Tri-PADD-visor Top 10 Attractions on Cait , LtJG Jovenan, USS Artemis -A , 240007.26
• ↑ Rubicun star system , Memory Alpha
• ↑ Rubicun III , Memory Alpha
• ↑ The frontier of history and the future , Lt Jovenan, USS Artemis -A , 240103.25
• ↑ Garden of Death , Lt Jovenan, USS Artemis -A , 240104.10
• ↑ A blessing and a curse , Lt Jovenan, USS Artemis -A , 240104.04
• ↑ 9.0 9.1 9.2 9.3 9.4 9.5 Edo , Memory Alpha
• ↑ 10.0 10.1 10.2 You’ll never stop worrying about your family , LtJG Jovenan, USS Artemis -A , 240008.21
• ↑ Justice (episode) , Memory Alpha
• ↑ 12.0 12.1 Luxury Tour , Farquan, USS Invicta , 239206.30
• ↑ 13.0 13.1 Longing for the Paradise , Ens. Jovenan, USS Excalibur -A , 240002.10
• ↑ 14.0 14.1 Penalties , Farquan, USS Invicta , 239207.08
• ↑ Ensign Maria's Condition , Lt Sidney Riley, USS Independence , 238307.18
• ↑ Fear not, my young padawan , Lt Jovenan, USS Artemis -A , 240101.23
• ↑ "Upwards We Go" , Ens. Saralai, USS Gorkon , 239901.18
• ↑ This place is kinda cool , Ens. Jovenan, USS Excalibur -A , 239912.02
• ↑ Making new old friends... and enemies , Lt Jovenan, USS Artemis -A , 240102.07
• ↑ 20.0 20.1 Edo God , Memory Alpha
• ↑ We are not so different , LtJG Jovenan & MdJG Jovenan, USS Artemis -A , 240010.09
• ↑ If there's no sound in space, can god hear our prayers? , Ens Jovenan, USS Excalibur -A , 239912.11
• ↑ 23.0 23.1 A bond from another universe , Lt Vitor Silveira & LtJG Jovenan, USS Artemis -A , 240012.20
• ↑ Zombies! , Lt Sidney Riley, USS Independence , 238307.25
• ↑ 25.0 25.1 In the deep end , LtJG Jovenan, USS Artemis -A , 240012.09
• ↑ It Wasn't Pleasant... , Ens Alashia Edar, USS Independence , 238312.10
• ↑ The Edo is dead. Only the Romulan remains. , Lt Jovenan, USS Artemis -A , 240103.11
• ↑ We're All Broken Within, Brother , LtJG Jovenan, USS Artemis -A , 240007.22
• ↑ [1] , Lt Jovenan, USS Artemis -A , 240102.23
• ↑ ... but the life goes on , Ens Jovenan, USS Excalibur -A , 240002.18
• ↑ 31.0 31.1 Linian vajos ren, jialon res , LtJG Jovenan, USS Artemis -A , 240010.29
• ↑ The best hug in ages , Ens. Jovenan, USS Excalibur -A , 240002.02
• ↑ "Sugar and Spice" , Ens. Selara, USS Arrow , 239707.21
• ↑ "Dinner Date" , Farquan, USS Invicta , 239209.16
• ↑ "Piano Man" , LtCmdr Saveron, USS Invicta , 239206.28

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Justice (episode)

• View history
• 1.2 Act One
• 1.3 Act Two
• 1.4 Act Three
• 1.5 Act Four
• 1.6 Act Five
• 1.7 Log entry
• 2 Memorable quotes
• 3.1 Production history
• 3.2 Story and script
• 3.3 Production
• 3.4 Cast and characters
• 3.5 Sets and props
• 3.6 Continuity
• 3.7 Reception
• 3.8 Video and DVD releases
• 4.1 Starring
• 4.2 Also starring
• 4.3 Guest stars
• 4.4 Co-stars
• 4.5 Uncredited co-stars
• 4.6 Stunt doubles
• 4.7 Stand-ins
• 4.8 References
• 4.9 External links

Summary [ ]

Invited to come along

Upon his return back from the surface, Commander Riker tells everyone on the bridge with great enthusiasm about the planet; he explains that the planet's inhabitants, the Edo , are almost identical to Humans , and that it is a class M planet, beautiful and stunning. Doctor Crusher suggests shore leave for everyone, stating that nothing is better than fresh air and open spaces. Lieutenant Natasha Yar states that the inhabitants' laws and customs are pretty straightforward and nothing out of the ordinary. What is special about them, however, says Geordi La Forge , is their great affection for others… and the fact that the Edo make love at the drop of a hat. " Any hat, " Yar adds.

The doctor's suggestion of shore leave is approved but only for a small group at first. Among them is Wesley Crusher , whom the captain personally designates as the one to evaluate this planet as a place for young people to relax. If their scans and observations support the report from the away team, then shore leave for the entire crew will be approved, says Captain Picard . He just hopes the planet it is not too good to be true.

Before they beam down, however, Commander Data continues to receive a faulty reading in the sensors, indicating there is something in orbit, despite the fact that nothing appears on the viewscreen .

Act One [ ]

"Nice planet."

Commander Riker, Lieutenant Yar, Lieutenant Worf , Wesley, and Counselor Deanna Troi beam down to the surface where they are passionately greeted and welcomed. Two of the planet's inhabitants, Rivan and Liator , introduce themselves by hugging everyone in turn. Worf compliments them on their planet and uncomfortably accepts the hugs and affections. Wesley isn't sure how to take them and how to react. Overall, these aliens are warm, empathetic, and seem to have thought of everything. Suiting to their fit and joyous lifestyle, people do not walk anywhere, but run and jog along. They wish everyone health and happiness, even passers-by as they run to the counsel chamber. When they arrive, three children take Wesley to play right away, while the adults enter the chamber to find more of a massage parlor, where people are playing games, dancing, exercising, receiving massages, hugging, and kissing.

Meanwhile, aboard the USS Enterprise -D , Data has completed his analysis. None of the internal systems are at fault; the reading, though mysterious, is accurate. It appears to be some sort of shadow, like something that is "neither in nor out of their dimension". When the main viewer is not showing anything out there, Data hails the empty space, requesting that it identify itself. Suddenly, a strange object fully appears and the ship enters automatic red alert .

Act Two [ ]

The sensor readings do not make any sense, and the response to their transmission is difficult to decode. When La Forge looks out of the window with his VISOR , he experiences the same confusion; it is as if whatever he is seeing is not really there. Data, however, is finally able to make out something, stating that the message they are receiving translates as something like "stand by". Then, a small, transparent, sphere exits the alien structure, and passes right through the Enterprise 's hull, moving through corridors and bulkheads .

Communicating with Data

The shimmering sphere of light makes its way to the bridge, and then rocks the entire ship as it speaks. Captain Picard speaks with it, explaining, between shakes, who he is, and that he is on a mission of peaceful exploration. It then demands to know why they have come to visit. Picard explains that they have sent down an away team to make peaceful contact and that he does not plan on leaving lifeforms there. It asks about the colony they just planted and Picard explains terraforming , and that they would only do it for uninhabited worlds. It gives a warning not to interfere with its "children" below (on the planet) and then tries to communicate with Data through some unknown method. Data says " I do not understand how but it is asking me if I was constructed for information exchange. " Picard encourages him to go along with it and the object then communicates directly with Data, who falls unconscious.

Down on the planet, Worf is extremely uncomfortable with the advances of the women, avoiding them as much as he can. He is not much concerned with pleasure, according to himself, as he is a warrior. Plus, he is convinced that these women couldn't handle his Klingon mating habits. When Riker fails to contact Enterprise with his combadge , he gets nervous and orders everyone together, including Wesley, just in case. Troi doesn't believe it is anything these people have done, since they are much too open and friendly. Nevertheless, Riker has Troi head outside with him to look for Wesley.

" …and just who tells visitors about these rules?! "

Yar, who is just fascinated by the Edo, is talking with Rivan and Liator about their laws as Worf approaches to brief her on the situation. They explain to her that there is no crime in their world and that no one breaks the laws. A long time ago, there was much disorder, but no longer. They explain that they have no police or law enforcement but instead have so-called Mediators who select only one area each day for a certain period of time: the punishment zone. It is a completely random selection, no person ever knows when or where a zone will be and so no one risks death .

The Edo explain to Worf and Yar, who are both very disturbed by this news, that there is only one punishment for any crime: death. While it sounds drastic, the Edo consider it very wise and a basis for their lasting peace. After all, since no one would want to risk execution, no one breaks the rules. Hearing this, the two officers are immediately alarmed and head off to find Wesley quickly, who they realize knows nothing about these rules.

Act Three [ ]

" I'm really sorry! "

While Wesley is playing ball with the others, he jumps for it in midair, crashing into a small greenhouse structure past a short white bar, disturbing the new plants within. The mediators then arrive. The Edo youth attempt to cover for him, pleading that he is only a visitor and did not know he was committing an infraction, but the mediators are adamant and insist on applying the law equally to everyone to avoid chaos, crime, and disobedience. It pains them deeply what they have to do, but given the circumstances and existing canon of laws, they have no other choice. As one of them raises a syringe to inject Wesley, Worf and Yar draw their phasers and Riker knocks him down to the ground. The mediators are taken aback by this, not knowing why they are not allowed to simply execute the boy. They are disappointed in the Enterprise crew, stating that they thought they came as friends. Riker tries to contact the Enterprise but there is still no response.

On the ship, the bubble finishes its information exchange with Data and disappears, leaving him unconscious. At the same time, communication is restored. After being informed of the situation, Captain Picard beams down to the planet.

Act Four [ ]

Picard tries to save Wesley

Picard arrives in the council chamber, and the dialogue begins. They regret that their system of justice is troubling him. Liator explains that Wesley is being held, pending the execution of his sentence at sundown, and they stand by their system of justice. They explain that the tranquility in their lives has been made possible by their laws, for they are a people of law. Picard makes the argument that when Earth executed criminals, they thought for the longest time that it was necessary to do so until they learned to detect the seeds of criminal behavior; capital punishment is, therefore, no longer considered a justifiable deterrent.

Liato feels that Picard is suggesting some kind of a superiority. He suggests that the Enterprise just use their superior powers to rescue the boy, stating that they would just record him as a convicted criminal out of their reach, an advanced person who luckily escaped the barbarism of their "backward little world". But Picard tells them that he wants to honor and respect the Edo's rules and law, referencing the Prime Directive.

The crew hears Wesley's fate

He takes the time, since the Edo guarantee Wesley will not be harmed, to ask about the vessel in orbit. The Edo recognize it as their god , who is said to be somewhere "up there"; a protector who is far above them, both here and in another place, with great powers. Doctor Crusher calls in, and says Data wishes to speak with him urgently. Not wanting to involve all of the Edo, and not sure if he accepts their description of god, he beams himself, Counselor Troi, and a frightened Rivan up to the Enterprise .

Rivan cowers in fear before her God

On the way to a room with a window, Rivan is amazed at "the city" in the sky, and is surprised that with all this power, they do not just take Wesley. When she sees the object in orbit, she kneels and bows down before it immediately, confirming that yes, it is god. Rivan seems to be extremely frightened by the object. Deanna coaxes her to explain that she can identify it because it has appeared before. Suddenly, it then thunders for Picard to "return its child," and begins moving closer. Hurriedly, Picard attaches his combadge to Rivan and has her beamed back to the planet's surface, and the object moves off again.

In sickbay, Picard then talks to Data about his experience. When Data regains consciousness he explains to Picard everything that was communicated to him. Data says that it's not one entity (it is many) and they know that the Edo worship them as a god thing and feel that said worship is " quite expected and harmless at the present Edo stage of evolution. " Data also states that the "god" aliens are inter-dimensional beings and thus can be in several places at once, and due to this the "Edo Gods" consider this entire star cluster to be theirs. He then points out the obvious that it was unwise to place a Human colony in this star cluster and then rambles on about potential colonization until Picard stops him and says " Data! Don't babble. Please organize it into brief answers to my questions. "

They continue to talk until Data "volunteers" the information that the Edo God aliens may be observing them now as they know everything Data knows (including the Prime Directive) and may be watching to see what the Enterprise will do next. Finally, Picard asks how the Edo God aliens would react if they were to violate the Prime Directive and Data answers that they would consider the Enterprise crew to be "deceitful and untrustworthy" and subsequently reminds Picard that the Edo God aliens warned them to not to interfere with their children below. Dr. Crusher begins to cry and Data starts to babble on about "the emotion of motherhood" when he is abruptly cut off by Crusher telling him to " Shut up! " It is at this moment that Data realizes that he does, in fact, babble.

Act Five [ ]

"Would you choose one life over one thousand, sir?"

Picard sends for Data to ask more questions, as he attempts to try and put together what he knows into some sort of decision. Picard asks Data to help him with this decision and Data asks in response "What level of communication, sir?" Picard smiles and says "Any. My apologies for saying that you babbled. You see things in a way we do not but as they truly are."

Picard is torn between following the letter of the law, and the knowledge that the Prime Directive never intended to cover a circumstance like this. Data states simply that it is the object he should be worrying about. They know of the Prime Directive, but how it will be viewed is the question. How would they react to taking Wesley, especially with regard to that warning? While pondering these questions, Picard asks if breaking the Prime Directive and saving Wesley's life will potentially endanger the entire Enterprise and the 1,000 people who live on the ship. Data answers his question with " Would you choose one life over 1,000, sir? " and Picard responds sternly that he " refuses to let arithmetic decide questions like that. "

Data believes that they did exist earlier in our dimension, but now are taking advantage of their present abilities. Perhaps they did share a value system like that of the Federation and existed in some flesh and blood form previously. Picard asks why would such an advanced species feel obliged to protect the Edo. Data theorizes that the Edo are a child race they have chosen to protect just as the Federation puts down colonies and protects them.

When Dr. Crusher arrives, Picard lets her beam down with him, and announces his decision: under no circumstances will he allow the Edo to execute Wesley, regardless of the cost. Picard simply states that he will ensure Wesley will not be executed, but in a way everyone will agree upon. The mediators do not like it, saying he cannot understand what they were like before. Picard knows what they went through and their laws were in the spirit of justice for them, which does not mean being executed for such a minor offense. Risking the wrath of God – and the Federation when he returns – he gives the order to beam up. Nothing happens.

"When has justice ever been as simple as a rulebook?"

When the Edo are vindicated, Picard then shouts to the ceiling that " there can be no justice so long as laws are absolute. " He elaborates that such laws as these – without degrees of punishment, and with such severe consequences – cannot be just. He argues that rules should also have exceptions, and that rules with no exceptions can never be just. The transporter works.

When they return to the ship, Picard hails the object to inform them they are leaving, and that the colony will be removed at its signal. It dematerializes, which is enough for Picard. With Wesley's life saved, the Enterprise departs.

Log entry [ ]

• Captain's log, USS Enterprise (NCC-1701-D)

Memorable quotes [ ]

" Nice planet. "

" Let's hope it is not too good to be true. "

" They make love at the drop of a hat. " "Any hat. "

" Rivan, perhaps they can't run. " " Can't run?! Of course we can run! Right, Commander? "

" They certainly are... fit. " " They certainly are. "

" When in Rome , eh? " " When in where, sir? "

" DO NOT INTERFERE WITH MY CHILDREN BELOW. "

" This may be nothing, but let's move all our people together. " " Including Wesley, the boy? "

" RETURN MY CHILD. "

" We'd better find Wesley. "

" Sharing an orbit with God is no small experience. "

" I want to do something too! With you. " " Uh... what? " " Something you can teach me. Will you? " " Well, actually, there are some games I... uh, don't quite know yet... " " It's playing ball. Will you teach me? "

" It was probably unwise of us to attempt to place a Human colony in this area. Of course, there are three thousand four other planets in this star cluster in which we could have colonized. The largest – and closest – " " Data! Don't babble. " " Babble, sir? I'm not aware that I ever "babble", sir. It may be that from time to time I have considerable information to communicate, and you may question the way in which I organize it – " " Please – organize it into brief answers to my questions. We have very little time. Do they... accept our presence at their planet? " " Undecided, sir. " " ... " " ... " " Data... please... feel free to volunteer any important information. "

" The Edo want to execute my son. I will not allow that to happen, Jean-Luc. " " Most interesting, sir. The emotion of motherhood is, compared to all others felt by Hu.. " " SHUT UP! " " You were right, sir. I do tend to babble. "

" I'm with Starfleet; we don't lie. "

" You're not involved in this decision, boy! "

" There can be no justice so long as laws are absolute. Even life itself is an exercise in exceptions." " When has justice ever been as simple as a rulebook? "

" Seems the Edo Lord agrees with you, Number one . "

Background information [ ]

Production history [ ].

A camera report for "Justice"

• John D.F. Black 's original story outline: 5 January 1987 ( Creating the Next Generation )
• John D.F. Black's second draft story treatment: 17 February 1987 ( Creating the Next Generation )
• Worley Thorne 's first draft story outline: 16 March 1987 ( Creating the Next Generation )
• Second Worley Thorne story outline: 6 April 1987 ( Creating the Next Generation )
• First draft script: 29 July 1987 ( Creating the Next Generation )
• Final draft script: 27 August 1987
• First revised final draft script: 3 September 1987
• Second revised final draft script: 4 September 1987 [1]
• Filmed: 8 September 1987 – 16 September 1987
• Premiere airdate: 9 November 1987
• UK premiere ( BBC2 ): 28 November 1990 (aired out of order)

Story and script [ ]

• This was the first script to be commissioned for the series after the pilot episode " Encounter at Farpoint " (then known as "Meeting at Farpoint") was written. Due to the extensive rewrites that the story went through however, it ended up being the eighth episode to be filmed. ( Creating the Next Generation )
• Writer John D.F. Black used his pseudonym " Ralph Willis " in the credits, because the televised episode bears little resemblance to his original first draft script. In Black's treatment, the colony of Llarof installed punishment zones to fight anarchy; however, the zones are now enforced to abide the law, but for only those who are deemed not immune to them. An Enterprise -D security guard, Officer Tenson, protecting two children while on shore leave, happens upon a crime scene, and is shot dead by the policeman Siwel, who is also killed by his partner Oitap on the spot, for misinterpreting his duty. In his first draft, Picard decides not to help the rebels led by Reneg who fight against this system of council member Trebor. Finally, it turns out the rebels install a similarly totalitarian regime when they gain power. In the second draft, the rebel leader, called Reneg is put on trial and executed for treason. Picard muses on the topic of people having their right to decide their own justice without interference. ( Star Trek: The Next Generation Companion , 1st ed., p. 40; Creating the Next Generation , p.44-45)

Production [ ]

• This episode was the first to feature location shots since the holodeck scene in " Encounter at Farpoint ". The Edo exteriors were filmed at the Tillman Water Reclamation Plant in north Los Angeles, and the section with Wesley's fall at the Huntington Library in Pasadena. ( Star Trek: The Next Generation Companion , 1st ed., p. 40; Star Trek Encyclopedia , 2nd ed., p. 422) The Tillman Plant was used to represent Starfleet Academy and Starfleet Headquarters in later Star Trek episodes.
• The Tillman plant was right under the flight path of Van Nuys municipal airport, which meant that airplanes were constantly flying over the head of the actors, and the entire scenes filmed there had to be re-dubbed in post production. [2]
• Some filming for this episode also took place on Paramount Stage 6 . That sound stage was used near the end of the installment's production schedule. ( Starlog , issue 126, p. 46)

Cast and characters [ ]

• Josh Clark , who later went on to play Joe Carey in Star Trek: Voyager , appears here as an unnamed tactical officer. Given the time frames of TNG and VOY , it is possible that this unnamed officer is Carey, assuming a later transfer to Engineering division and departure from the Enterprise -D prior to 2371 .
• This episode marks the first appearance of recurring season one background actor Steve Reed who was hired at his local gym for this episode.
• Guest actor Richard Lavin also appeared in the second season episode " Loud As A Whisper ".

Sets and props [ ]

• The Edo God model was later reused as Lysian Central Command in TNG : " Conundrum ".
• The statue seen in the corridor outside the starboard lounge was previously seen in Deanna Troi 's quarters in the episode " The Naked Now ".
• The guitar -like instrument used by one of the Edo bears a striking resemblance to Adam's guitar seen in the Star Trek: The Original Series third season episode " The Way to Eden ". Another similar instrument appeared later in the first season episode " When The Bough Breaks ".

Continuity [ ]

• This marks the first of four times the Captain shows a native female her home planet from orbit. This happens again with Nuria in " Who Watches The Watchers ", Mirasta Yale in " First Contact " and Lily in Star Trek: First Contact . This approach clearly has meaning to the Captain as he tells Anij in Star Trek: Insurrection , seeing his home planet from space for the first time was a moment where time stood still.
• It also marks the first time the Captain is believed to be a god by a native inhabitant of a pre-warp civilization. The only other time is Nuria from " Who Watches The Watchers ".
• The Prime Directive is violated by Captain Picard by interfering in the Edo's judicial system. This was referenced by Lieutenant Commander Dexter Remmick later in season one in " Coming of Age ".
• Additionally, pre-warp civilizations are normally off-limits, yet Picard states in the opening that they discovered the planet Edo only just now. It is never explained on what basis they are permitted to contact the planet to begin with. Later episodes such as " Who Watches The Watchers " and " First Contact " explain the prohibition on contact with primitive civilizations unequivocally.
• Riker tells Worf " When in Rome... " while they are running with Rivan and Liator on Rubicun III. Nine years later , Julian Bashir says the same thing to Worf during their trip to Risa in DS9 : " Let He Who Is Without Sin... ". Jonathan Archer also said this to T'Pol (who also did not understand the reference) while hosting a Tellarite delegation on Enterprise NX-01 210 years earlier in ENT : " Babel One ".
• This episode bears a resemblance to TOS : " The Apple " in that both involve a starship coming into contact with an Eden-like planet under the direction of a godlike machine.
• This is the first time that Data takes the helm when Picard and Riker are away.

Reception [ ]

• A mission report for this episode by Patrick Daniel O'Neill was published in The Official Star Trek: The Next Generation Magazine  issue 4 , pp. 5-8.

Video and DVD releases [ ]

• Original UK VHS release (two-episode tapes, CIC Video ): Volume 4 , catalog number VHR 2395, 6 August 1990
• UK re-release (three-episode tapes, Paramount Home Entertainment ): Volume 1.3, catalog number VHR 4644, 1 June 1998
• As part of the TNG Season 1 DVD collection
• As part of the TNG Season 1 Blu-ray collection

Links and references [ ]

Starring [ ].

• Patrick Stewart as Captain Jean-Luc Picard
• Jonathan Frakes as Commander William T. Riker

Also starring [ ]

• LeVar Burton as Lt. Geordi La Forge
• Denise Crosby as Lt. Tasha Yar
• Michael Dorn as Lt. Worf
• Gates McFadden as Doctor Beverly Crusher
• Marina Sirtis as Counselor Deanna Troi
• Brent Spiner as Lt. Commander Data
• Wil Wheaton as Wesley Crusher

Guest stars [ ]

• Brenda Bakke as Rivan
• Jay Louden as Liator

Co-stars [ ]

• Josh Clark as Conn
• David Q. Combs as 1st Mediator
• Richard Lavin as 2nd Mediator
• Judith Jones as Edo Girl
• Eric Matthew as 1st Edo Boy
• Brad Zerbst as Medical Technician
• David Micahael Graves as 2nd Edo Boy

Uncredited co-stars [ ]

• James G. Becker as Youngblood
• Darrell Burris as operations division officer
• Steve Casavant as Edo
• Steven Craig as Edo
• Jeffrey Deacon as command division officer
• Susan Duchow as operations division officer
• Nora Leonhardt as science division ensign
• Tim McCormack as Bennett
• Lorine Mendell as Diana Giddings
• Steve Reed as Edo
• Tricia Sheldon as Edo
• Brian Sterling as Edo
• Edo God (voice)
• Edo massage girl
• Female medical officer
• Female science division crewmember
• Female science division officer
• Four command division crewmembers
• Four operations division crewmembers
• Science division officer
• Transporter chief (voice)
• Two Edo musicians

Stunt doubles [ ]

• William Perry as stunt double for Wil Wheaton
• Stunt double for Brent Spiner
• Stunt double for Richard Lavin

Stand-ins [ ]

• James G. Becker – stand-in for Jonathan Frakes
• Darrell Burris – stand-in for LeVar Burton
• Dexter Clay – stand-in for Michael Dorn
• Jeffrey Deacon – stand-in for Patrick Stewart
• Susan Duchow – stand-in for Denise Crosby
• Nora Leonhardt – stand-in for Marina Sirtis
• Tim McCormack – stand-in for Brent Spiner
• Lorine Mendell – stand-in for Gates McFadden
• Guy Vardaman – stand-in for Wil Wheaton

References [ ]

admission ; age ; air ; " all right "; alarm relay ; ancestor ; answer ; area ; arithmetic ; " as if "; " as per "; " at least "; " at this moment "; away team ; away team report ; ball ; barbarism ; bat ; bow ; branch ; bridge ; bridge ; " by comparison "; captain's log ; children ; choice ; city ; class M ; CMO ; colonist ; " come in "; " come on "; common sense ; concept ; consciousness ; contact ; Council Chambers ; creature ; crime ; criminal ; criminal behavior ; curiosity ; custom ; dance ; danger ; day ; death ; death penalty ( capital punishment or execution ); defense ; deflector ; desktop monitor ; dimension ; disorder ; Earth ; Earth-like ; Eden ; Edo ; Edo God ; efficiency ; Emergency Manual Override station ; emotion ; enforcement ; ensign ; error ; evolution ; existence ; experience ; Federation ; fence ; " flesh and blood "; fountain ; friend ; friendship ; " from time to time "; game ; garden ; " go ahead "; god-like ; god thing ; grass ; guilt ; guitar ; hailing frequency ; happiness ; harm ; harp ; hat ; health ; hello ; holodeck ; home ; hostage ; hour ; Human ; idea ; ignorance ; " in accord "; " in a moment "; " in a way "; " in effect "; information ; information exchange ; intruder alert ; intruder relay ; joy ; justice ; kiss ; Klingon ; language circuit ; law ; lifeform ( life ); lifestyle ; listening ; location ; logic circuit ; lounge ; love ; main phaser bank ; main viewer ; " make love "; malfunction ; massage ; Mediator ; medical tricorder ; Milky Way Galaxy ; mind ; minute ; motherhood ; music ; necklace ; nemesis ; " no doubt "; nudity ; number one ; object ; obligation ; observation ; " of course "; " one moment, please "; orbit ; order ; " out of breath ": painting ; patient ; peace ; permission ; person ; place ; plant ; planet ; playing ; pleasure ; precept ; poison ; police ; pride ; Prime Directive ( Non-interference directive ); probe ; problem ; promise ; punishment ; punishment zone ; question ; ready room ; reason ; recreation ; red alert ; relationship ; result ; Rhea ; Rome ; Rubicun III ; Rubicun star system ; rule ; rulebook ; running ; sadness ; Saturn ; scan ; scanning device ; sensor ; sensor channel ; sensor glitch ; sensor technician ; sex ; shadow ; shield ; shore leave ; " short and sweet "; sickbay ; signal ; " sit down "; sky ; society ; spectral analysis ; " stand by "; starboard ; stardate ; Starfleet ; statue ; stellar cluster ; stick ; stranger ; Strnad colony ; Strnad solar system ; Strnad solar system planet ; sundown ; supply vessel ; syringe ; talk ; " the good life "; thing ; thought ; thousand ; tranquility ; transgression ; transmission ; transporter room ; tricorder ; truth ; turbolift ; type I phaser ; unnamed plants ; value ; viewscreen ; visit ; visitor ; VISOR ; wall ; warrior ; " what the hell "; " when in Rome "; white ; window ; wisdom ; witness ; word ; worship

External links [ ]

• " Justice " at Memory Beta , the wiki for licensed Star Trek works
• " Justice " at Wikipedia
• " Justice " at the Internet Movie Database
• " Justice " at MissionLogPodcast.com , a Roddenberry Star Trek podcast
• "Justice" script  at Star Trek Minutiae
• 1 Daniels (Crewman)
• 3 Jamaharon

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The Prophets vs Q Continuum

Discussion in ' Star Trek: Deep Space Nine ' started by Quantum_Q , Mar 29, 2010 .

Quantum_Q Ensign Newbie

I am relatively new to the entire Star Trek universe, but after having finished watching both TNG and DS9, I can not help but wonder if the Prophets, as a lifeform, is anything similiar to the Q Continuum. So, my question to all you Trek experts is: What is the difference between the Q Continuum and the Prophets? That is, what other similiarity exist between them and differences, and which of these two life form is at a higher level of evolutionary advantage?  

PorthosShadow Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

Quantum_Q said: ↑ I am relatively new to the entire Star Trek universe, but after having finished watching both TNG and DS9, I can not help but wonder if the Prophets, as a lifeform, is anything similiar to the Q Continuum. So, my question to all you Trek experts is: What is the difference between the Q Continuum and the Prophets? That is, what other similiarity exist between them and differences, and which of these two life form is at a higher level of evolutionary advantage? Click to expand...

GotNoRice Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

Did we ever see any evidence that the prophets were able to project their power from beyond the wormhole? I mean other than stuff like Orbs, I'm talking about directly. In fact, it seemed like at many times during the series the wormhole was in danger and it was talked about as if the prophets would die if something bad happened to the wormhole. Doesn't sound very Q-like.  

Withers Captain

They were subject to chroniton radiation and could be killed by it apparently. The Q were certainly never in any danger of something like that from human beings. As to the Prophets projecting their power beyond the Wormhole... well, that's complicated. Look at the events of Shadows and Symbols . Weyoun actually says to Damar that it's inexplicable but releasing the Pah-Wraith into the wormhole turned the tide of the entire war in their favor. Add to that this; The entire cast is about to be annihilated (in three different scenarios); Kira and Odo are about to be vaporized by Romulans, Bashir, O'Brien, Worf, Martok and Quark are all about to die in a failed attempt to blow up the shipyards at Rondak, and Sisko is about to lose his mind and be trapped inside a Pah-Wraith created vision. Sisko finally opens the Orb, the Sarah Sisko Prophet casts out the Pah-Wraith from the wormhole, and suddenly Ross changes his mind making the Romulans back down which saves Kira and Odo, the mission at Rondak suddenly turns in our heroes favor, and Sisko comes to terms and has a vision from the Prophets clarifying that he did the right thing. Could it all be coincidence? Of course it could. It's maybe even likely that it is... but you can never be absolutely sure of that because it was left intentionally vague (I think anyway.) If all of that were thanks to the Prophets I would say their influence stretches way beyond the wormhole and has very tangible consequences, more so than the Q ever had (save for maybe that whole...super nova business on Voyager... but that was silly.) So it boils down to whether or not you "believe" in the Prophets. -Withers-​  

Penta Commander Red Shirt

Withers puts it brilliantly: In Trek, apparently, the question of the existence of God(s) is just as brain-warping as it is in real life. Ow, I sometimes hate metaphysics as much as I hate temporal mechanics.  

Penta said: ↑ Withers puts it brilliantly: In Trek, apparently, the question of the existence of God(s) is just as brain-warping as it is in real life. Ow, I sometimes hate metaphysics as much as I hate temporal mechanics. Click to expand...

Teiwaz Lieutenant Red Shirt

Withers said: ↑ Look at the events of Shadows and Symbols . Click to expand...

PorthosShadow said: ↑ I don't mean to connect it to any religion since those are creations of people but the exploration of higher plains are something else. Click to expand...

Edgy Pumpkin Ensign Red Shirt

Honestly, I would say no where near the level of Q. They cannot travel outside the wormhole (only in a spirit form or in someone. They cannot actually change time itself, they can only speak in riddles, they always refer everyone as corporeal (just reminds me of the arrogance of the changlings). They cant actually do anything just tell sisko what to do and he does it. All I see them doing is having some influence over the wormhole really. Lets say that there are 10 dimensions the prophets may can only control like 4 where Q can not only control all 10 but bend the will of the universe to make all other dimensions follow whatever he changed. And he seems he can make everything go in a place outside of time itself. And he can control death itself. Short the prophets may be powerful to our standards but the prophets seem only to control things directly in the path of the worm hole. Where as Q can control every galaxy, every inch of space  

Voth commando1 Commodore Commodore

If the prophets can be killed than I can't take them seriously as gods or beings worthy of adulation, worship, or submission honestly. The very fact that they can be killed IMHO ought to discredit Bajorans religion then and there it's demonstrated. At least beings like Q and the organians can't die(at least that we're aware of). So Q wins no contest.  

Triskelion Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

^That's funny, because some would never consider the Q gods despite their immortality; while others would accept as gods those whom have died. Maybe it's not so much about the physical form but the metaphysical aspects - and we did see that the Prophets existed in some dimension outside of spacetime, that very well could have some kind of afterlife effect on Bajorans, for all we know. So I guess what I'm saying is that immortality is not a litmus of godhood. Trek has any number of energy beings/noncorporeal entities: Q Bajoran Prophets Organians Medusans Squire of Gothos Cytherians Douwd (you remember that all-powerful godlike being, Kevin) Metrons Calamerain Caretaker Moriarty & Co. Plus a host of unnamed intelligent nebula matter-energy clouds, some with names (Nagilum), and also, normal humanoids that have shed their bodies to exist as energy - including the Zalkonians - and even the Vulcans. Janeway even encountered an alien "devil" trying to lure her into his "matrix", and she wondered about near death experiences as being (mundane) alien encounters. I suppose these beings have differing degrees of involvement in the physical spacetime continuum; some aloof, some actively invested in it. Some emerging from this universe, others encountering it from outside. I guess the lesson here is that we can evolve into higher states of being if we really try. Or also likley, make the universe a computer program like a (Keanu-type) Matrix, where godlike evolution is merely a cradle-to-grave illusion. Or even better, the recorded engrams of once-living beings could be self-aware replicas - who think they are omnipotent, but exist only in a Moriarty server. This would explain Trump's hair. (Ha ha, I went topical).  

Kick the Can said: ↑ ^That's funny, because some would never consider the Q gods despite their immortality; while others would accept as gods those whom have died. Maybe it's not so much about the physical form but the metaphysical aspects - and we did see that the Prophets existed in some dimension outside of spacetime, that very well could have some kind of afterlife effect on Bajorans, for all we know. So I guess what I'm saying is that immortality is not a litmus of godhood. Trek has any number of energy beings/noncorporeal entities: Q Bajoran Prophets Organians Medusans Squire of Gothos Cytherians Douwd (you remember that all-powerful godlike being, Kevin) Metrons Calamerain Caretaker Moriarty & Co. Plus a host of unnamed intelligent nebula matter-energy clouds, some with names (Nagilum), and also, normal humanoids that have shed their bodies to exist as energy - including the Zalkonians - and even the Vulcans. Janeway even encountered an alien "devil" trying to lure her into his "matrix", and she wondered about near death experiences as being (mundane) alien encounters. I suppose these beings have differing degrees of involvement in the physical spacetime continuum; some aloof, some actively invested in it. Some emerging from this universe, others encountering it from outside. I guess the lesson here is that we can evolved into higher states of being if we really try. Or also likley, make the universe a computer program like a (Keanu-type) Matrix, where godlike evolution is merely a cradle-to-grave illusion. Or even better, the recorded engrams of once-living beings could be self-aware replicas - who think they are omnipotent, but exist only in a Moriarty server. This would explain Trump's hair. (Ha ha, I went topical). Click to expand...

The Q can be killed, as we saw in Deja Q and The Q and the Gray. They are not all-powerful for all time. For all we know, the only power of the Q is to manipulate electrochemical sensation on a mass scale. That is considerably beneath omnipotence. Avatars die, yet they can be considered divine, I think I read that somewhere. No, not the blue ones. I'm not sure what use ranking energy beings by power achieves, (is it a contest)? Nor would someone, particularly Bajorans, have to accept your labeling of the Prophets as non-divine as a self-evident fact. You see, you and I are not in a position to authorize divinity. Only to judge whether you yourself wish to accept a fictional race as such or not. I'm not sure if you are arguing divinity vs non-divinity, or the validity of divinity itself. I can say, though, that the mantle probably doesn't rest with your or my say so. The Q are not gods and do not deserve worship any more than Picard did in Who Watches the Watchers. The jury is out on the epic good vs evil Pah/Wraiths. Oh, and add the Edo god to my list.  

Kick the Can said: ↑ The Q can be killed, as we saw in Deja Q and The Q and the Gray. They are not all-powerful for all time. For all we know, the only power of the Q is to manipulate electrochemical sensation on a mass scale. That is considerably beneath omnipotence. Avatars die, yet they can be considered divine, I think I read that somewhere. No, not the blue ones. I'm not sure what use ranking energy beings by power achieves, (is it a contest)? Nor would someone, particularly Bajorans, have to accept your labeling of the Prophets as non-divine as a self-evident fact. You see, you and I are not in a position to authorize divinity. Only to judge whether you yourself wish to accept a fictional race as such or not. I'm not sure if you are arguing divinity vs non-divinity, or the validity of divinity itself. I can say, though, that the mantle probably doesn't rest with your or my say so. The Q are not gods and do not deserve worship any more than Picard did in Who Watches the Watchers. The jury is out on the epic good vs evil Pah/Wraiths. Oh, and add the Edo god to my list. Click to expand...

Okay maybe the Q can kill the Q but not mere mortals by far. If the average Greek hoplite can find away to destroy Zeus then would anyone worship the Greek pantheon? No of course not-the prophets powers are limited at best they can manipulate events near the wormhole and maybe just maybe farther afield, maybe the cardassians had they stayed and discovered the wormhole would have applied chroniton radiation to crush both the prophets and bajorans resistance once and for all.  

Q even has stated as much that he is no god, (yes he teases picard, but that is for his own amusement). He has even stated in TNG that they have evolved into the Q even though the Q cant remember a time where they wasnt Q. So Q continuum just may be the most known evolved species (whoever they where before). We dont even know if they are from the milky-way or from some other galaxy eons of eons of light years away. He told picard that humans just may as well evolved past the Q one day. He has also stated to picard that there are things in the universe that he couldn't begin to understand or even comprehend, the mere thought of what is out in the universe is maddening. The prophets may be worshiped by the bajorans but just because something is worshiped doesn't make them gods. (just look at the changlings). But what we are talking about is who is more powerful. Picard was shot his heart frying his plastic heart, Q took him in death and allowed him to change his life (actually changing history) just to teach picard a lesson. And furthermore was going to take picards plastic heart and give him a spanking brand new organic human heart.  

Just having seen and confirmed that apparently Sarah Sisko was possessed by a prophet-that's a little disturbing the main character's mom is possessed by these weird alien thingies. Anyway I apologize for my vulgarity. The prophets have never set well with me-the writers want us(the viewers to treat them as gods not aliens) and by the end of the series they had basically drilled that premise into the heads of the audience anyway I just hated that.  

Voth commando1 said: ↑ Just having seen and confirmed that apparently Sarah Sisko was possessed by a prophet-that's a little disturbing the main character's mom is possessed by these weird alien thingies. Anyway I apologize for my vulgarity. The prophets have never set well with me-the writers want us(the viewers to treat them as gods not aliens) and by the end of the series they had basically drilled that premise into the heads of the audience anyway I just hated that. Click to expand...

Nightdiamond Commodore Commodore

The Prophets may be more powerful than we think. They exist outside of time, not within it, so they see the past, present, future simultaneously. A lot of the evolved entities seemed to be stuck within time and couldn't time travel. Apparently the Dowd couldn't do it, otherwise he could have retrieved his wife from the past. The Prophets suggested it was easy for them. Then in one episode they altered a person's entire personality. In another, they (or the Wraiths) brought a person back from the dead. On one hand they seem limited, on the other in certain episodes you see them doing weird but powerful things  

Leviathan Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

So...just checking here....this thread is NOT about which one would win ina fight? (totally going with the Q on this one....regardless of who has more power, the Q are MUCH bigger bastards....often the deciding factor in a battle)  

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Star Trek: The Next Generation (TV Series)

Justice (1987), brenda bakke: rivan, photos .

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Rivan : Captain Picard! I saw you share the sky with God. You must be gods.

Rivan : Health and happiness!

[Edo greeting] 

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What is the strongest Star Trek being/species that MCU Thanos can "snap" out of existence?

• Thread starter Meredith Fayer
• Start date Feb 3, 2019

Meredith Fayer

• Feb 3, 2019

I'd say all of them short of the extradimensionals ones like the Q.  

SableCold said: I'd say all of them short of the extradimensionals ones like the Q. Click to expand... Click to shrink...

Meredith Fayer said: Okay, so Q, Nagilum, and the Edo god. And perhaps others like The Traveler (arguably) and maybe Species 8472, if they're in fluidic space when Thanos snaps. Click to expand... Click to shrink...

SableCold said: Pretty much. You'd have to argue that the Infinity Gems can affect things outside of the Universe otherwise. Click to expand... Click to shrink...

Meredith Fayer said: This is speculation, but do you think energy beings are necessarily doomed against Thanos? Can we know for certain that an Organian, Trelane, or Douwd would be taken out? Click to expand... Click to shrink...

SableCold said: It would depend. The implication with those energy beings is that they've evolved past being bound to this universe, although I'm not sure that's ever stated outright. If that is the case, then they're probably beyond the Gems' reach. OTOH, if they've just evolved past physical forms but are still tied to this universe, then they'd be fair game for the Gems. Click to expand... Click to shrink...

Meredith Fayer said: The Edo god exists in multiple dimensions simultaneously and so is more advanced than "normal" humanoids. Click to expand... Click to shrink...

Battleships just are.

Perhaps Kevin Uxbridge?  

• Feb 5, 2019

Tank man said: Perhaps Kevin Uxbridge? Click to expand... Click to shrink...

• Feb 9, 2019

Meredith Fayer said: Kevin's durability allowed him to survive his colony's destruction by the Husnock, and, later, his house's obliteration by the Husnock-ship re-creation. That in of itself isn't enough to stand up to Thanos, but I don't think that Thanos has feats of killing energy beings, and certainly not on the level of the Douwd. Click to expand... Click to shrink...

It seems like a NLF to say that the stones destroy any and all life. We don't have any showings of them destroying something on the Douwd's level.